In this podcast, we discuss a new piece of legislation, the Tax Relief for American Families and Workers Act of 2024. Since its passage by the House of Representatives on January 31st, the popular press has written much about this bipartisan bill, H .R. 7024. It provides the business tax breaks that Republicans can support, and the expanded child tax credit required by Democrats. Several senators, though, have expressed concerns over the bill and expect to offer amendments such as an unlimited deduction for state and local taxes.

If the Senate passes anything that is not identical to the current version, the bill will need to be taken up again in the House. And with the elections coming up in November, this bill may just run out of time. We do not know what will be in the final bill or if we will even have one. But what is in the bill that has many excited? Charles Dean Smith, Jr., CPA, one of our tax experts and member of the firm’s Emerging Tax Issues Group, explains.

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Transcript

Andrea
Hi everyone. Today we have a special episode that affects basically all of us who pay our taxes. We’re going to talk about some pending legislation right now called the Tax Relief for American Families and Workers Act of 2024. Since its passage by the House of Representatives on January 31st, 2024, the popular press has written much about this bipartisan bill, H.R. 7024.

It provides business tax breaks that Republicans support and the expanded child tax credit required by Democrats. But the Senate doesn’t have much remaining time to act on this proposed legislation. As they return from recess, the Senate will still need to deal with another continuing resolution and the impeachment trial of Secretary Mayorkas. Several senators have expressed concerns over the bill and expect to offer amendments, such as unlimited deduction for state and local taxes.

If the Senate passes anything that is not identical to the current version, the bill would need to be taken up again in the House. And with the elections coming up in November, this bill may just run out of time. We do not know what will be in the bill or if we will even have one. But what is in the bill has many excited. Luckily for us today, our guest speaker will steer us through some of the highlights of this legislation and their impact on individuals and businesses. Our guest today is Charles Dean Smith. He is a senior tax partner with more than 25 years of experience as a trusted advisor to businesses and individuals in a wide range of industries, including consumer products and retail, agribusiness, real estate, and professional services.

He has also worked with several large national franchise groups for the past 20 years, providing tax compliance and planning services.

Hi, Charles Dean. Thanks for joining us today. I’m going to stop talking and let you talk through some of this legislation. So this will be, it’s not speed dating, but it’ll be a speed legislation or whatever we want to call it. So why don’t we get going and you know, please enlighten us and give us your thoughts on this.

So why don’t we start off with the child tax credit? Tell us about that.

Charles Dean Smith
Sure, Andrea, and thanks for the opportunity. But I will start with, we thought this tax season was going to be quiet after several disruptive ones over the past two years, but this tax bill came up as a big surprise in January. No one saw it coming, or we didn’t think there was ever a chance. And here we are waiting on the sidelines to see what will actually happen. And the problem is we’re still filing 2023 tax returns or holding them, trying to figure out what’s gonna happen in some of these situations. And our clients are getting anxious and they don’t know what to do. So for the child tax credit, that’s the main provision that affects individuals. And so what it’s doing is increasing the refundable portion of the credit for qualifying children to higher levels, similar to what they were back during COVID, when a lot of people got large refunds for these credits if they had a lot of eligible children.

And this provision was added because a lot of senators and legislators would not agree to the business tax provisions unless the child tax credit was included at the same time. So we couldn’t get business tax breaks unless we got some individual and child tax credit breaks at the same time. So that’s why this is thrown into this primarily business tax legislation. It was to get the bipartisan support that the bill needed.

Andrea
Okay, so this legislation is primarily business, but with this pretty generous child tax credit that sort of, for those of us with children, we remembered that sort of, that flood of money. Okay, so I got that. So…

Charles Dean Smith
Yes. And it’s not nearly the same amount. It’s higher than it would have been, but it’s not back to the COVID levels. There were some compromises done to bring it down some.

Andrea
So that’s the end of it. So that affects individuals and those who are listening with children.

Charles Dean Smith
And one more thing on that is they did allow in that provision if the credit does happen to change and it does affect your 23 return, the IRS says they will adjust that return automatically for individuals and you won’t have to amend the return. Now in the past, the IRS has struggled with that, but they say they can do it. So it does help individuals so they won’t have to go back and amend a return if this goes through.

Andrea
I was actually going to ask you about that because with new legislation, usually you go back and refile. They’re going to help us out a little bit and now we’ll fix it for you. Okay, so that’s good news. I mean, it’s probably good news for you too, because you’re the one working on these returns for folks.

Charles Dean Smith
Yeah. It is.

That’s right. And retroactive tax bills like this are kind of rare. Typically, they’re only prospective going forward. But almost everything in this bill is retroactive, which is what makes it so frustrating for us.

Andrea
All right, well, stay tuned on that one. Okay, so the next one here is the deduction for domestic research and experimental expenditures. So R&E expenditures. Tell us about that one.

Charles Dean Smith
This one has hit a lot of businesses very hard, especially if they were high-tech companies or they did a lot of research internally or life science companies or any business that is just constantly designing new products or pharmaceuticals or anything. And it could be any business because there are some businesses that you would not expect that has R&D expenditures and they do, they have a level of those expenses. But the problem is back when we got the last legislation passed, there was this provision thrown in there that starting in 2022, you could not deduct R&E expenses, that businesses would have to capitalize those amounts and amortize them over five years if they were domestic R&E expenses. International expenses have a longer life.

At the time that bill was passed, people thought it would just get changed before it ever became effective, that we would just keep kicking the can down the road. Well, it never got kicked, and it actually got in effect for 2022, and it took a lot of businesses by surprise when all of a sudden they were not able to deduct these large expenses for RME. And so it increased their taxable income significantly in 22, and will also in 23, unless this tax law changes.

Andrea
Mm-hmm.

Charles Dean Smith
So we had a lot of clients that all of a sudden had these humongous swings in income because we had to go in and capitalize all these expenses and they weren’t able to get that deduction in one year like they were used to. Right.

Andrea
I guess that’s it.

They couldn’t deduct it. Okay, so let me put a plug in for a future web podcast, but I wanna ask you something. So research and experimental expenditures. We have one of our partners coming on later to talk about R&D tax credits. Are these the same thing?

Charles Dean Smith
Thank you.

Charles Dean Smith
Yes, those credits work in relation to this. So if you have R&D expenditures that you have to capitalize, most likely you will also be eligible for an R&D credit. It does help offset some of this income adjustment. It doesn’t cover, it’s not a wash. But it does help with the paying if you do get this credit at the same time.

Andrea
Okay.

Charles Dean Smith
So it does work together. So typically, if you had an R&D credit in the past, clearly you have R&D expenses that you will have to capitalize. But we do have some clients who chose not to do an R&D credit in the past for various reasons, but they did have R&D expenses. Well, now because they’re having to capitalize R&D expenses, they are now looking at R&D credit studies for the first time ever to help offset having to do this.

Charles Dean Smith
There is a lot of opportunity now with R&D studies because of this tax law change. More people are getting, more people are more attractive to or willing to listen to an R&D potential study. Yeah.

Andrea
Well, keep your calendar open. If this legislation passes, I’m going to have you come back on with our R&D tax credit expert. And you know, you guys can talk through this and explain. Yeah, so that’s going to be actually quite interesting. All right. Third one here, business interest expense limitation.

Charles Dean Smith
Yeah.

Andrea
What is going on there?

Charles Dean Smith
This one this one only affects really large businesses. I think the threshold in this year is over 26 million dollars in gross receipts or 27 million in gross receipts. So this like I said is really large groups of businesses or a really large business. So again when previous tax legislation was passed one of the provisions to help pay for that legislation was we would put in new limitations on interest expense deductibility for taxes. And so, the original law was more flexible and we were able to do some other adjustments that made the calculation better. In basic terms, the calculation is you can’t deduct more than 30% of your net income as interest expense. That’s the basic calculation.

Charles Dean Smith
But what happened in 22, that threshold that we used to calculate the 30% changed. It became much lower because it includes depreciation and amortization now. Before 22, it did not include it, so the net income number was much bigger. So our 30% number was larger before 22. Now it’s a much lower number for businesses, especially if they have a lot of depreciation.

Andrea
Okay.

Charles Dean Smith
And the other thing that’s happening is because interest rates have gotten so high, people are paying more interest expense businesses are. And so this change is coming at a really bad time and hurting a lot of businesses who are highly leveraged or just did a large transaction or acquired a business and they use financing for it. They’re getting hit with this interest expense limitation at the same time as they’re paying a lot more interest expense.

Charles Dean Smith
And so just like the R&E change, this is causing a lot of businesses to pay a lot more in income taxes now. And so the good thing about this one and the R&E, these are both retroactive to 22. So if this does change, there will be some amended returns required for 22, but they will be refund claims, and that’s always good for a business.

Andrea
Okay, yeah, that’s good motivation for amending.

Charles Dean Smith
Yes, right. You know typically, people don’t mind amending to get a refund. It’s when they have to amend to pay more they don’t like. But this one in the R&E really helps really large businesses that – like I said – got stuck with some really large tax liabilities unexpectedly in 22 and 23. Yep.

Andrea
Okay, all right. I’m following what you’re saying. So this is good. I’m not a large business though. Okay.

Charles Dean Smith
Right, and that’s why I say a large majority of our clients do not fall under the business interest expense limitation. They just, they don’t hit the threshold. It’s not something they really need to worry about. It’s, you know, the top 3% of our clients perhaps.

Andrea
Okay, next one here. 100% bonus depreciation extension.

Charles Dean Smith
So, bonus depreciation has been around since the days of 9/11. It was a tax provision that came out right after 9/11 to increase the economy, get businesses to buy new equipment, and that’s when it first started. So, it’s been around forever. And it’s been at various thresholds. It’s been at 100%. It’s been at 50%.

Andrea
Okay.

Charles Dean Smith
It just goes back and forth. It’s been at 100% for several years. But again, back when we passed the most recent tax legislation, in order to pay for it, there was a lot of these pay-for provisions, bonus depreciation thresholds would have to drop starting in 23. So we were at 100% up until 22. For 23, we are currently at 80%. For 24, we’re at 60%.

Charles Dean Smith
And we will drop each year until we go to zero. But in basic terms, bonus depreciation means if I buy a piece of equipment that has a tax life of less than 20 years, which is usually almost, leasehold improvements to building just basic equipment, a lot of things are eligible. You can write off the whole thing when it’s 100%. If it’s 80%, I can deduct 80% of it in the current year.

Charles Dean Smith
And the other 20% I have to depreciate over that tax life. So you spread the expense off out over the asset life instead of taking it all in one year. So it’s a timing thing on when you get the deduction for the equipment you bought. So bonus depreciation, you accelerate it up front, get it all in one year. When that drops, you have to spread that expense out longer. So it takes you longer to get the full deduction. So for most clients, this is a very good change. But honestly, for a lot of our smaller clients, the midsize clients, they were already getting depreciation write-offs using a 179 expense option, which is similar to bonus in that you can deduct the full cost of equipment in the year you purchase it up to over a million dollars or so.

It’s not that big of a change for most clients. And like I said, it’s mainly, again, for some of the larger companies who are not eligible to take 179 expense.

Andrea
So let’s just say I own a small construction company. I build decks and porches and that sort of thing. So I buy a truck to cart material around – will this bonus depreciation apply to me? Or is this for a larger business? You know, perk or whatever you want to call it.

Charles Dean Smith
Yeah, no, it would apply to you. You would deduct the cost of the truck. Depending on the size of the truck, if there are some rules on autos, there are certain autos that we can’t deduct the whole cost. We have to take it over a longer period. So a truck is not the best example. Well, you get the deduction, but there’s some limitations. If you bought a computer, for example, you would deduct the whole cost using either bonus expense. So you would get the benefit of this provision.

Andrea
All right. Next up, increase in limitations on expensing depreciable business assets. Well, that was a mouthful.

Charles Dean Smith
Yeah. So this is the 179 that I was just talking about. Tax geeks call it Section 179. That’s just how we talk about it. And it’s very similar to bonus depreciation. It allows when you purchase new equipment for tax purposes, we can write off the cost of that equipment in the first year even though we know the equipment will last many years.

Andrea
Mm-hmm.

Charles Dean Smith
The tax law allows you to deduct it in the first year. This is by far the most popular tax provision that small businesses use. Everyone uses this. That’s why they go out and buy new trucks and equipment in December at the end of the year. It’s all part of their tax planning. I have so many clients that they just have to have a new truck every single year and they call the week of Christmas to ask how much is my ride off going to be if I buy this new truck before the end of the year?

Charles Dean Smith
And what they’re doing is using this provision for the 179. And so what this new provision does is it increases the limit to a much higher threshold. And it also increases a phase-out limitation. This one is not nearly as big of a change as the bonus depreciation because for smaller businesses, they were already taking the full amount anyway. So.

Charles Dean Smith
Most of our clients will not see a big change with this chain, this provision at all. This one is really more for the larger companies too. Yep.

Andrea
Okay. So, when you said every year, could you just keep buying unlimited numbers of trucks and keep deducting this? Or does the IRS come back and say, wait a minute?

Charles Dean Smith
Well, some people think that. Yeah, unfortunately some people do think that. There’s a thing that I tell clients is, if you need the equipment, yes, go out and buy it. But don’t go out and buy a piece of equipment just because you think it will save on tax because it’s not dollar for dollar. You’re still, okay, so either you’re gonna pay 40 cent income tax or you’re gonna pay all of this for this equipment.

So unless you need it, just don’t go out and buy in just a half if you think you’re saving on taxes. Because you’re still only paying $0.40 on tax. So the way I look at it is if you go out and buy a big piece of equipment, you’re getting a discount code of 40% on that piece of equipment. Because that’s what you’re saving on the taxes. But yes, I do have some clients who just think, I just want to go buy something just to save on tax. I may not need it.

And I’m like, no, look at the cash flow behind your reasons first. It doesn’t work like you think sometimes with that.

Andrea
I just want to pause there because I’ve heard you say this, but just for our listeners, your role as an advisor to clients is not, let me go out and save you as much money as possible. What you’re really doing is giving them the best advice so they can grow and their business can flourish. And it’s not like, take every tax deduction you can. Sometimes it’s not that straight. So I just wanted to make sure that our listeners know you’re a tax CPA, but you’re also an advisor for growth. And the other thing I want to mention that I didn’t say at the beginning is that you are a member of what we call in our firm the Emerging Tax Issues Group, (ETIG). Tell us just a little bit about that group and how you guys are not just looking back, but you’re looking forward.

Charles Dean Smith
Sure. So yeah, I’m a member of the emerging issues group. And we monitor tax legislation throughout the year. We meet weekly to discuss pending legislation. We have a member on our group that’s heavily involved in the Washington DC area, has a lot of connections with the IRS and Congress and lobbyists and stuff. So we get a lot of inside information from him.

You know, honestly, it’s just a bunch of tax geeks that meet weekly that just love talking about IRS and tax laws and what we see on the horizon and we brainstorm about, you know, where can we be aggressive or where’s there some possible gray areas and where is some additional guidance needed and we try to communicate that out to the firm and our clients, you know, areas where we see opportunity coming in the future.

Andrea
Mm-hmm.

Charles Dean Smith
We also discuss some danger areas we see, how can we plan ahead to offset those danger areas. Because there are a lot of pending tax law changes coming in the horizon, especially as we enter 2025 and actually after this election year. There will be a lot of tax law changes coming that we have to get ahead of now and start telling our clients so they can plan ahead because our fear is tax rates will increase significantly once the current tax laws sunset in 2025 at the end. So we’re expecting a major tax overhaul in the next one to two years.

Andrea
There are a lot of provisions from the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act that are going to be sunsetting. So I want to make sure that I get the members of, you know, the group, you know, scheduled because we’re going to need to start talking about that because that’s going to start really affecting people. So, and just another plug for your group, I’ve listened in on a few of those. You might be tax geeks, but you’re actually a lot of fun.

Andrea
It’s a very interesting… Okay, so you know there are some other issues here that maybe we can just touch on briefly. So this one – provide tax relief for Taiwanese companies. What’s going on there?

Charles Dean Smith
That is something I think some lobbyists got included at the last minute. I think it’s a very isolated situation that someone must have wanted included, which you see that sometimes in tax legislation that for some reason a lobbyist was able to get something through for a specific industry or one of their constituents was pushing them for this. So I think that’s what that’s for, but that will not affect probably any of our clients.

Andrea
Okay. So something that will affect our clients and you and I probably personally, because you’re in Coastal Carolina and I’m in Coastal Virginia, modify federally declared disaster zone rules.

Charles Dean Smith
Yes. Right.

Charles Dean Smith
So in the past when you would have a federal disaster, the IRS was always playing catch-up. So a lot of times when you have a federal disaster, the IRS will come out and say, you get more time to file your tax return. We relaxed the rules on casualty losses. You can take a retirement plan distribution penalty free or pay it back. Different provisions just to help some taxpayers who have been affected by disaster.

Charles Dean Smith
This provision makes it more proactive with the IRS. So it makes it more automatic. If there is a natural disaster, these benefits come in automatically. They don’t have to wait for congressional action to do it. The benefits get pushed out to the taxpayers much faster. And so it will help taxpayers in these areas get tax relief faster.

Charles Dean Smith
It’s not really additional tax relief. It’s all about the timing and getting it out faster and not waiting for the IRS to issue something. It lets the IRS speed it up.

Andrea
So it would be like, okay, they caught up and then would you have to file an amended return? So this would probably eliminate that.

Charles Dean Smith
Yeah, right. So we had some clients who would file the return because the IRS hadn’t gotten around to issuing the guidance. And they may not have claimed the casualty loss. And so then they would have had to go back and file an amended return to get it. Well, now with this, they can include that casualty loss under some new rules upfront and not have to do amended. Or they know upfront that…

Okay, my tax return is not due on the normal due dates. I get some additional time to file my return instead of, because we’ve had situations where the IRS has changed the due date for some of these returns, like three days before it was originally due. And so, I mean, it doesn’t help us or the clients that much when they do it so late. It’s much better if they know way in advance. Yep.

Andrea
That’s good. So I finally caught up. Okay. Adjust affordable housing credits.

Charles Dean Smith
That one, I don’t, I have, honestly, I have not kept up with that one that much. So that one, I don’t think is that big of a change though, but I honestly haven’t kept up with that one that much.

Andrea
Okay, all right, well we’ll make sure that we flag that. We’ll flag that in case it goes through and we’ll get somebody on here. We’ve got members of your group.

Andrea
Okay, the last one here, increase the reporting threshold for certain information returns such as 1099. So first of all, tell us what a 1099 is.

Charles Dean Smith
So a 1099 is when you either sell something or self-employed people get it when they do business with another entity or person. That business is required to issue you a 1099 showing the value of services that you gave them. So you mainly see it in the self-employed area. You know, there’s a lot of gig workers who are, you know,

Charles Dean Smith
Etsy or selling online or an uber driver or something like that That’s how most of their income is reported is on 1099 instead of you and I or traditional employees getting W2 their income is all reported on the 1099 and so this Legislation would change some of these reporting thresholds and make them higher and more flexible because there’s been a lot of push for…

Charles Dean Smith
Some background. If you’re on Venmo or different payment service apps or something like that, and you’re sending money back and forth, the IRS came out about a couple of years ago and said, if you reach a certain threshold, Venmo has to issue you a 1099.

Charles Dean Smith
And so that’s where a lot of people were getting caught by surprise. That doesn’t mean necessarily though that it’s taxable to you. It just means you have to report it on your return, but you can make adjustments on the return to show that it’s non-taxable. The problem though is a lot of people were, they don’t know how to do it, especially if they were doing their own return. They didn’t know how to adjust that to make it non-taxable. So this would change the reporting thresholds for certain transactions like that to be at a much higher level.

Charles Dean Smith
to keep people out who randomly use Venmo for personal reasons or different things. They just weren’t thinking about it when they pushed this out originally with that threshold so low that, you know, parents paying their kids through Venmo or family members or anything like that, they just didn’t realize how many people would get caught up in this 1099 reporting problem. And so this helps increase the threshold and get more people out of having to do all that special reporting on their individual return. So this is a good change for most taxpayers.

Andrea
Okay, $64,000 question coming up. So this is pending legislation. Should somebody consider filing an extension for their individual or business return? How would you advise? And just for everybody listening, this is Charles’ opinion. This is, you know, this is not a guarantee. He’s not telling you to go do something.

Charles Dean Smith
No.

Andrea
but his suggestion works.

Charles Dean Smith
So most individuals, if they do not own a business or they don’t own a pass-through business such as an S-corporate partnership, they should just consider filing their return as normal if they have all their documents ready. None of these provisions would change that return and with the IRS saying that they will fix the child tax credit if it changes in their system automatically and issue the additional…

Charles Dean Smith
there’s no reason for them to delay filing their return. And that is why the IRS has come out and said multiple times when they opened up for tax filing season the end of January, they have said, don’t hold your returns, go ahead and file as normal for individuals. For businesses, though, you have to evaluate your exposure to some of these areas. So first of all, if you’re a really large business with gross receipts over $26 or $27 million, and you have interest expense limitations in the past, and you have R&E expenses, you should evaluate extending the return. And the main reason we say that is there’s a provision in the IRS that allows us to file superseded tax returns. And so what that means is we’ve filed an extension…

And we can file your return, but if something comes up and we need to change your return, we are able to change your return up until the extended due date of that return by filing a superseded return that goes on top of what we filed the first time. So it’s like we do a new version. So we file version one, something happens with the tax law, we can go in and file a version two…

Charles Dean Smith
with very limited issues, it’s pretty easy for us. It’s not an amended return. It just goes on top of that original filing. And it makes it much cleaner to make changes. And like this situation with tax law changes, we were able to update the return pretty quickly. And that’s one of the main benefits of filing an extension for business returns is to allow for those superseded or updated returns to be filed instead of having to do an amended return.

Andrea
Mm-hmm.

Charles Dean Smith
So like I said, most large businesses, did you have R&E? Do you have a lot of interest expense? Did you get hit with that limitation in the past? And if you did, you really should be talking to someone about filing an extension just to wait and see what happens. It’s just too risky at the moment.

Andrea
Yeah, so I think best advice is talk to a professional, like yourself. And, you know, it’s always good to get a professional’s insight in this.

Charles Dean Smith
Yes.

Charles Dean Smith
And I will say, I know a lot of clients get uneasy about extensions. Extensions are not a bad thing. We encourage extensions. It just helps because, you know, we have a little more time to look over things like this if there’s a tax law change or if you find out, you know, a month from now that, oh, I missed that entry or I missed, I forgot to include that…

Andrea
Mm-hmm.

Charles Dean Smith
Then we still have time to go back and include it in the return. And so extensions are not a bad thing. They’ve gotten the bad rap over the years. But most of our larger clients that are high net worth individuals, they will file an extension because they understand the benefits of doing it. And they would rather us take our time and work on it during the summer or the fall. And they understand. So I just want to put that out there.

Charles Dean Smith
Not a bad thing. Extensions are good.

Andrea
Yeah, and actually you’ve written about this on our blog. So yeah, so if anybody wants to go read more about Charles Dean’s thoughts on extensions, go to our blog on our website. And that is really, it’s good advice. I think, you know, maybe they got a bad rap because, well, I know I’m going to OTAC, so I’m going to extend.

Charles Dean Smith
All right.

Andrea
That doesn’t mean you don’t have to pay the tax, right?

Charles Dean Smith
Right. Yeah, I mean, we still have to come up with a good estimate number. And honestly, there’s a lot of rounding we do. We try to round up to be conservative. There’s some different ways we can handle that. We can have you pay with the extension. And then if you do have a refund, we apply it to your estimates for the next year. So there’s ways we can manage that cash flow with the extensions to protect you from penalties and interest. And

Charles Dean Smith
It’s just really worth the time, I think, to go through the extensions for most people.

Andrea
Okay. Well, I know that you’re going to be watching this as well as the rest of the group. And, for listeners, watch the blog, sign up to get alerts. We’re sending out alerts on this. So our folks are watching all this and we definitely want to probably bring you and maybe some of your group back. Maybe we even put a webinar on  if it passes.

Charles Dean Smith
Yeah.

Andrea
Please keep your calendar open for us. I know this is a busy time for you, but you know, this has been great. Charles Dean, I know you are always looking out for clients, trying to guide them in their best interests. And this is just an example of some things to be on the lookout for.

Anything you’d like to say to the listeners before we say goodbye?

Charles Dean Smith
Just like Andrea said, watch our website for tax alerts and blog articles and I’m heavily involved on LinkedIn. I’m posting a lot of updates there from various sources. So we will let you all know as soon as we hear something, we hope it comes quickly because it’s just adding a lot of stress on us at the moment in a very busy time that we were not expecting this to happen. It just came out of nowhere.

Andrea
Yeah.

Andrea
Is it okay if we include your LinkedIn address in the show’s notes and follow him. He’s got some good stuff out there. All right, well, thanks again, Charles Dean. Hope you have a great weekend. And I guess April 15th can’t come soon enough, right?

Charles Dean Smith
Sure, absolutely. Sure. You can find me on Linkedin at charlesdeansmithpbmares.

Charles Dean Smith
You too.

Charles Dean Smith
It comes fast every year. Yep, it does. Thank you, Andrea.

Andrea
Fast and furious. All right, you take care. Thank you.